Home   Forum   Classifieds   Tech/DIY   News   Articles   Chat   Contact Us

Best 606a ?

Forum rules
Welcome to the Tech/DIY information archive. This area of the board is for reference purposes, please direct general tech discussion to the G Wagen Technical Forum.
User avatar
Djakefry
Posts: 103

Best 606a ?

Post#1 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 5:15 am

So

I am happy to report I found what I think is a great 460. Hopefull will get it within a week or two. It the very clean 85. 280 advertised on this site

My intention is to drive it, as is, this winter and in the early spring converte it to diesel. From what I read and discussed thus far seems that the 606a is best option.

I've also been strategizing this with the fellow whom will help me with this project. We feel it may be prudent to get donor car which may provide the trove of various brackets and bits required for the project.

As getting this engine is the first step In the process I was wondering if there is one model of model of merc with the 606 which is better than another for this project.

The other question is transmission - I happy to leave it as a automatic just to reduce scope of project but will a viable tranny likely be paired with this engine or is this a separate hunt.

User avatar
vadimivanovich
Posts: 8643

Re: Best 606a ?

Post#2 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:58 am

Any 97-99 W140 S300 or W210 E300 Turbodiesel will have the right engine for you.

You could use the sedan transmission as well, but it will require an electronic controller that will cost you about $1K, plus some tuning & wiring time. There are non-electronic transmissions that would work - anything 1995 or older with the OM602/3/5/6 diesel or M104 engine.

You will need the OM603 fuel injection pump - use it as-is for conservative power, or get it tuned for $1500-2000 for massive power potential (and the cooling & longevity headaches that can go with it).

There are many other details such as intercooling, transmission cooler, engine oil cooler, G-specific water pump ($), G-specific oil pan ($$$), G-specific engine mount arms (cheap), turbo control (swap to pressure actuator $50), tons of plumbing, center drive shaft ($$$), etc.

That will be one dream-G if you manage to get it all dialed in right!
"The way you think is the way you live"

G Nome
Posts: 7766

Re: Best 606a ?

Post#3 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 7:19 am

Congratulations Jake!

Look forward to seeing this develop. Nice clean G to start with. Good choice.

Kent
Kent
If you need help...I usually have extra zip ties and duct tape.

User avatar
Djakefry
Posts: 103

Re: Best 606a ?

Post#4 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 7:28 am

Thanks for this info Vadim

specifically your comments

"There are many other details such as intercooling, transmission cooler, engine oil cooler, G-specific water pump ($), G-specific oil pan ($$$), G-specific engine mount arms (cheap), turbo control (swap to pressure actuator $50), tons of plumbing, center drive shaft ($$$), etc."

is an area I look forward to digging into over the next few months

User avatar
vadimivanovich
Posts: 8643

Re: Best 606a ?

Post#5 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 9:43 am

Jake, I suggest you contact Guido (offroadworld) on this forum. He is an excellent resource in Germany who will be able to help you with the difficult to source parts. In the USA we have a few sources too: Gwagenpreserve, Eurotruck, Couch, and Fourbyfourclub are ones I'm aware of.

As for details specific to making the swap, carefully read forum threads from others doing the same.
"The way you think is the way you live"

User avatar
Chris
Posts: 4549

Re: Best 606a ?

Post#6 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 10:02 am

OM606a is the best diesel engine choice but when installing into a 460 G, like all diesels it needs the correct gearing to be worth the $ and effort.

OM606 swaps are fairly complex and expensive endeavors so in order to get the best results I recommend you fit an overdrive transmission at all costs, the 722.6 transmission used with all OM606a is the best there is, but you need the aftermarket transmission computer controller made by Ole Feger.

A stock 280GE will happily cruise on the freeway for days on end at or above 4500rpm (6700rpm redline!!) and also be amazingly capable in slow technical off-road situations too.
A properly tuned 280GE should return 14 mpg (U.S.) cruising at 60mph.

When you replace the 280 engine with a turbodiesel unit you now have a engine that falls flat on its face above 4300rpm so top speeds are dramaticaly reduced if no overdrive gear is added, the turbo motors are most efficient around 2400-3600 rpm so if cruising rpm at 60mph is to high expect to not get much more than 15mpg.

The biggest drawback to the turbodiesel (compared to 280) is in technical off-road situations under 2000rpm where the engine makes zero torque. This was drastically obvious on the rubicon trail G treffen last year:

The 230G with 90hp 4 cylinder gas motor effortlessly idled over the big rocks while the OM606 G with stock turbo, intercooler, tubular exhaust manifold, and modified injection pump from Finland (250hp) just sat there with its front tires against the rock with the throttle mashed, rolling coal and going nowhere.

So before you trash the 280 motor, be sure you are replacing it with a drivetrain that will actually improve the vehicle to a degree justified by the trouble and cost of such a project.
IG: #traildustrestoration

User avatar
offroad-world
Posts: 9813
Contact:

Re: Best 606a ?

Post#7 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 10:15 am

is there anybody who has mounted a 711.116 wolf gearbox with crawl gear behind an OM606A motor ?

mfg. guido .
300GDT OM617A Kastenwagen, 2850mm wheel base
250GDT OM602A Single Cab, 3400mm wheel base , gone to friend Orest

User avatar
Djakefry
Posts: 103

Re: Best 606a ?

Post#8 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 11:37 am

Chris

Thanks for the Advice, it is my intention to drive this vehicle for a while before committing to the conversion.

RussG
Posts: 150

Re: Best 606a ?

Post#9 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 11:44 am

Chris wrote:OM606a is the best diesel engine choice but when installing into a 460 G, like all diesels it needs the correct gearing to be worth the $ and effort.

OM606 swaps are fairly complex and expensive endeavors so in order to get the best results I recommend you fit an overdrive transmission at all costs, the 722.6 transmission used with all OM606a is the best there is, but you need the aftermarket transmission computer controller made by Ole Feger.

A stock 280GE will happily cruise on the freeway for days on end at or above 4500rpm (6700rpm redline!!) and also be amazingly capable in slow technical off-road situations too.
A properly tuned 280GE should return 14 mpg (U.S.) cruising at 60mph.

When you replace the 280 engine with a turbodiesel unit you now have a engine that falls flat on its face above 4300rpm so top speeds are dramaticaly reduced if no overdrive gear is added, the turbo motors are most efficient around 2400-3600 rpm so if cruising rpm at 60mph is to high expect to not get much more than 15mpg.

The biggest drawback to the turbodiesel (compared to 280) is in technical off-road situations under 2000rpm where the engine makes zero torque. This was drastically obvious on the rubicon trail G treffen last year:

The 230G with 90hp 4 cylinder gas motor effortlessly idled over the big rocks while the OM606 G with stock turbo, intercooler, tubular exhaust manifold, and modified injection pump from Finland (250hp) just sat there with its front tires against the rock with the throttle mashed, rolling coal and going nowhere.

So before you trash the 280 motor, be sure you are replacing it with a drivetrain that will actually improve the vehicle to a degree justified by the trouble and cost of such a project.


My favourite G was my 460 280 with standard 4 speed auto. My 603 engined 463 was never as good in slow speed technical off road situations. The Same 463 now has a normally aspirated 606. Day to day driving is great but off road even in low range 1st it's not as usable as the 280 and of course at 70+mph it's revving it's proverbials off! It has the factory fit manual Getrag.

Being non turbo the conversion was pretty straightforward, it already had a mechanical pump. If I base the electronic knowledge I'd stick with the factory pump on the 606a (ironic as I'm an electrical engineer but I'm more used to mega watts than millions amps)

User avatar
AlanMcR
Posts: 7729

Re: Best 606a ?

Post#10 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 12:58 pm

I suppose there is no way to re-gear the W460 transfer case?
The W463 case came in two flavors. Originally, the transfer case came with a 1.05:1 underdrive in high-range. Starting with the G350 Turbo, that was changed to a 0.87:1 overdrive. That, along with the 0.83:1 overdrive in the transmission, drops the RPMs tremendously while still maintaining good 1st gear torque in low range.
...Alan

Return to “Tech: Diesel Engines and Conversions”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 19 guests